fine fine everybody disagree with tiggy  ....

guess i'll join the cool kids and go with what terre said.... 

^Pro

I hate to crush such a long winded post, but tiggy is completely wrong. Thats not how things work in computers - its stored in binary - not base 10.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floating_point#Floating-point_arithmetic_operations
It's complicated stuff, don't worry too much about it.

The numbers are generated using a linear congruential generator - java.Random. For this type of number generation it is adequate. see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_congruential_generator
http://docs.oracle.com/javase/1.4.2/docs/api/java/util/Random.html#nextInt(int)

Opti... it really goes against my better judgement to argue with you... and since i don't know the algorithm being used to generate the random numbers i can't actually disprove its reliability mathematically. However i can confidently say that i was not wrong in my earlier post, this algorithm "int randomNumber = (int)(Math.random()*(tickets.count()-1));" was rigged, and while i explained it in base 10, the principles of math don't actually change and it would've been much more confusing to try and explain it in base 2, because to do the math in base 2 would mean an even longer winded post that dives into the explanations of why a computer can't represent repeating decimals in 64bits regardless of how they're generated

and that, given the algorithm i was addressing at the time, would mean constricting the ability of the ranges (ie:0.0, .1111) to truncate to a ticket index even further as decimals such as .11111-> can't be represented accurately. this in turn gives an unfair advantage to certain ranges as repeating decimals were not created equally and can appear in different concentrations for different ranges.

However that algorithm isn't necessarily the one being used, unless of course you would like to say otherwise.
Unfortunately given the documentation you were so kind as to post one can only assuming you're using a floating point decimal to create random numbers, and of course java's lovely math.random class to generate said floating point decimal

Now, if you would be so kind as to go back to the documentation you linked and scroll down the page slightly.... you'd see what i was talking about...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floating_point#Accuracy_problems

furthermore the link to java's random class doesn't really prove anything.... as we can only assume you're using floating point numbers and there's really no explanation of how they work there.... however if we were to go to the documentation on java's math class (the class from which random inherits) http://docs.oracle.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/lang/Math.html
 you would be be aware of this

which basically states that when a number doesn't fit in the amount of space provided (64bits) it rounds up or down

Furthermore, you've stated you're using a linear congruential generator, which leaving this little tidbit aside

think about this, java is capable of generating 2^48 possible random floating point numbers - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_congruential_generator

"As shown above, LCG's do not always use all of the bits in the values they produce. The Java implementation produces 48 bits with each iteration but only returns the 32 most significant bits from these values. This is because the higher-order bits have longer periods than the lower order bits" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_congruential_generator

however in actual practice java creates only 2^24 possible random float values - http://docs.oracle.com/javase/1.4.2/docs/api/java/util/Random.html#nextFloat()

this is in direct correlation with the fact that some numbers can't be represented in 64bit binary such as .111->, .222->,
.525252525252->

what this all boils down to is the misrepresentation of decimals in base 2, which leads to erroneous calculations and inaccurate results, on the surface it seems insignificant, but when u do out the math u realize probability wise some numbers have an unfair advantage while others don't show up at all, and that equates to tickets that can never be drawn and ones that don't have the correct chance to be drawn. That in fact would be the definition of rigged.

Sincerely,
Tiggy

P.S. opti, i don't mean to question your intelligence, clearly you're capable to have made it this far, however i really like randomness, and you questioned mine.

Ok, let's set aside the algorithmic discussion for a minute because that's so WAY off from effecting the outcome of the lotto draw that it's not even worth mentioning.  It IS random, and it IS fair, because each consecutive draw doesn't include the winning ticket from the last draw, and a whole new random draw is done.  Plain and simple.

So, those of you who aren't winning, just suck it up and make the odds better in your favor.  Either find a four leaf clover, hang a horseshoe, or do something that'll improve your luck cause the odds of winning are only as good as the number of tickets you buy.

viper it effects the outcome big time if that's the algorithm being used..... it means that you would be paying for a ticket that has a 0% chance to be drawn.... not a .00000001% chance, a 0% chance. it's tossing your money in the trash for false hope.

//create a completely random number
        int randomNumber = (int)(Math.random()*(tickets.count()-1));

hate to break it to you chief but that isn't random....

i wont even begin to address the complete loss of precision going on here due to using decimal values....

that whole argument aside think about the concept of multiplying a decimal between 0.0 and 1.0 inclusive times a positive integer.

first argument,
lets say we have 10^1 tickets in the lottery (never gonna happen), if the random decimal is anything equal to/smaller than .111->, (0.0, .111...) then 9*.(0.0-.111...) = 0.something, truncates to = 0
it follows (.111...2, .22...)*9 = 1.something, truncates to 1...etc all the way to (.88...9, .99....)*9 = 8.something, truncates to 8 leaving only 1.0 as the sole possible random number for the person who bought the last ticket to win, whereas the previous 9 tickets all had a seemingly equal chance to be drawn.

this thought process can be applied to larger amounts of tickets, simply move the decimal 1 place to the left for each power of 10

10^4 or 10,000 tickets
9,999*(0.0, .00011..) = 0.something
9,999*(.0001...2, .00022...) = 1.something, truncates to 1
.... etc
9,999*(.00088.....9, .00099...) = 8.something, truncates to 8
9,999*(.001...) = 9 *note only a single way to truncate to 9*

the difference in this situation is the problem repeats for every tenth ticket.

9,999*(.00188...9, .001999...) = 18.something, truncates to 18
9,999*(.002...) = 19.something, truncates to 19 *note only a single way to truncate to 19*
9,999*(.002...3) = (according to windows calc) 22.997 (WTF HAPPEND TO 20-21?!?!?!?!?!?!)

this pattern continues throughout the sequence effectively screwing over every tenth ticket as well as many others.

now if that argument isn't enough of a reason to rethink that way of generating a random number lets take into account a brief example of the "loss of precision" i wanted to avoid discussing.

lets take a simple expression, we have 10,000 tickets in the lottery and the random double is .001111,

do it on paper, 9,999*(.0001111) = .9999, truncates to 0 (perfect)

now plug it into your calculator that come standard with any windows machine

9,999*(.0001111) = 1.110889, truncates to 1 (WTF RAGE LOTTERY IS RIGGED OMFG!)

this isn't a specific situation, it reappears at specific intervals depending on the amount of bits used to store the double variable because in computer world when a decimal doesn't fit in 8 bits, the computer picks the closest number that does.

Now, with my long lecture said and done, i really hate criticizing without contributing....

in an effort to prevent problems such as these from occurring i would suggest using a random integer for your random index generation, then manipulate that number into a usable index because integer values are less prone to loss of precision, or more simply just use the nextint function and bypass it all together.

also i would suggest shuffling the list of names/tickets so that you don't end up with giant chunks of names taking advantage of the better ranges to be in, it would be an overall better mix-up/randomization as both the tickets and the index of winning tickets have been randomized

sincerely,
Tiggy

*Breathes*

I wish you would have built a few more architectural builds but goodluck

well ben i got a big architecture build goin in builder atm if i finish it before the decision hammer hits my app i'll toss it in there

P.S. thanks everyone for the support

Ingame name: tiggy26668

Join date: Feb 16, 2012

Briefly describe all your creations: so far on this server I've created a panda ripping the head off a creeper, a panda riding a dragon carrying a sword and flag, an upside down collage of a beach house w/ blimp and boat adjacent, a replica model of my skin at the time (Goku), a Painted Turtle, and a whale killing a seal that's stabbing a panda in the back, that killed a penguin

when last i was rejected you were "interested in seeing another structure type build" so i spent 12 hrs and created a nice little tower for your consideration. it was made on guest and can now be found on recruit, though due to an oversight in transport it gained an extra office floor and lost the top globe, which is why the pattern changes in the middle between some pictures.

Added: 3rd times the charm? this time we have an epic little sand castle, it's made entirely of sand with the exception of the flags and floor, and uses the natural lighting of guest world to project shadows emphasizing the architecture of the castle, if that's not builder material i dunno what is.

What worlds are the creations on: First 5 were on guest world and the last on member,

tower built on guest, now on recruit

Added: Sand Castle Built on Guest774

Links to screenshots of the creation:
http://s1071.photobucket.com/albums/u509/tiggy26668/Opticraft/

http://s1071.photobucket.com/albums/u509/tiggy26668/new%20Opticraft/

Added:http://s1071.photobucket.com/albums/u509/tiggy26668/Sand%20Castle/

Names of players who helped contribute: N/A

What is your current rank in Opticraft ?: Recruit

Extra (Anything else you want to mention):
I tend to create 3d statues more than anything, was never much for buildings some other examples of my work are here
http://s1071.photobucket.com/albums/u509/tiggy26668/Creations/

Do you agree with our terms(http://www.opticraft.net/index.php?topic=3.0) ?: Yes